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General => General Help & Troubleshooting => Topic started by: Juju on August 03, 2017, 10:28:58 pm

Title: Building a computer for art school
Post by: Juju on August 03, 2017, 10:28:58 pm
So yeah, my mom is going to university in animation next semester (as a student of course) and she needs a pretty good computer for that, any tips? I have about a C$1000 budget for the graphics card alone (thanks some restaurant's foundation, that's helpful), plus probably another C$500-1000 for the rest. The parts shouldn't be hard to order either online or at the computer shop down the street.

Minimum configuration needed:
- Intel 64-bit 4th gen quadcore CPU
- 12 GB RAM
- 1 SSD (for the operating system)
- >1 TB hard drive (for data)
- NVIDIA Quadro K2200 (for 2D) or K4200 (for 3D), certified The Foundry and Autodesk
- Max. 2 screens (22-24", 1080p)
- Network card
- DVD burner
- Graphic tablet (not those ones with a screen in them, apparently the industry hates it because once you try it you can't go back)
- Keyboard and mouse (of course)
- Not a laptop

List of software needed (this list may vary without notice, and we already have them so I'm not asking for them, I'm just listing them so you have an idea of what kind of hardware I need):
- Autodesk Academic Resource Center (Entertainment Creation Suite Ultimate)
- ToonBoom Harmony
- zBrush 4R7
- NUKE The Foundry
- Houdini by Side Effects Software
- Marvelous Designer
- TV Paint
- Royal Render
- Arnold by Solid Angle
- ShotGun
- RV
- Lynda.com
- Gnomon
- Digital‐Tutors
- Golaem Crowd
- RealFlow
- Substance Live (Algorithmic)
- Video Copilot
- CGTextures
- Sound Ideas Series 6000 Library
- Sound Ideas Cartoon Express
- Adobe Creative Cloud 2017
- Adobe Stock Image
- Le Robert Correcteur 2.0.8

What I'm shooting for:
- AMD Ryzen 7
- NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1080, probably 8 GB of graphic RAM (The Quadros I want are a bit too expensive so unless I find a good deal I'm going with a similar GeForce, screw the certifications, hope they don't mind, Minty Root (who went in a similar school) says it should be okay)
- 16 GB RAM (the motherboard should take up to 32 or 64 GB)

Money spent so far: C$80
- HP screen 25" 1080p (C$80, previously owned by Kheirozen (https://www.twitch.tv/kheiroplays) on Twitch)

So yeah, first time I really do that, any tips? Any model I should buy?
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: gameblabla on August 03, 2017, 11:31:45 pm
Funny, my main PC's motherboard died (it was a bulldozer one, RIP AMD FX) and i just bought the parts to replace it.
Here are the main parts i bought :
AMD Ryzen 5 1500X
ASUS Motherboard at 70$ (don't remember the name sorry)
4GB G.Skill Ram
all for 272€ for no taxes with shipping.

But you should aim higher of course.
If you want to buy a Geforce GTX 1080, you should probably aim for a Ryzen 7 at least because they tend to have low IPCs compared to Intel.
The Quadro P5000 is good but is not cheap yeah.
https://www.pny.com/nvidia-quadro-p5000 (https://www.pny.com/nvidia-quadro-p5000)
They have tons of memory but they are tricky to set up. So a Titan or 1080 should do fine.

But DO NOT BUY A CHEAP POWER SUPPLY. Especially Corsair, they are awful.
Use FSP.
Also, don't use ASRock or Gigabyte for the motherboard.

Other than that, it looks good.
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: c4ooo on August 04, 2017, 12:11:54 am
GTX 1080 seems a bit overkill. But if you do plan to get a 1080, 70, or 60, do wait a few months, as GPU prices are kinda high right now due to miners.
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: Juju on August 04, 2017, 03:53:15 am
The video card is going to be used a lot for rendering and photoshopping, so yeah, we're gonna want the best of the best here. Also why I took a Ryzen, heard they're pretty good for those tasks and video processing. Anyway, the semester is beginning in a month or so, so I want them kind of right now.

Speaking of miners, heard you can get some for pretty cheap on eBay due to miners being discouraged by the bitcoin price right now, kinda weird.
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: _iPhoenix_ on August 04, 2017, 06:49:09 am
I have one a Mac Pro (used by my family, which sucks) and it is great at being a beast at pretty much everything I throw at it, but I'm not sure it will work with all the software you need.
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: Juju on August 04, 2017, 07:13:16 am
Ah yeah, it sure is a beast, a bit priced and a bit over my budget though, but yeah, I'd definitely want one. I think they want Windows, though. Which you can install on it, but still, I don't think the specs will exactly match.
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: c4ooo on August 04, 2017, 09:50:18 pm
Speaking of miners, heard you can get some for pretty cheap on eBay due to miners being discouraged by the bitcoin price right now, kinda weird.
Yea etherium prices fell so everyone want to cash out their GPUs, but I wouldn't buy them because those cards have been to hell and back mining.
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: gameblabla on August 04, 2017, 10:00:55 pm
I bought Ryzen but unfortunately, they suffer from crash issues under heavy-load.
https://phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Ryzen-Test-Stress-Run (https://phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Ryzen-Test-Stress-Run)

Several ppl were also able to replicate the issue in Windows.
So maybe using an Intel might be preferred for stability.

Once i get my ryzen proc in 2 days, i will try to use Linux-libre with ASLR enabled to see if disabling some microcode/microupdates
fix things. (probably not but worth a try)
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: _iPhoenix_ on August 04, 2017, 10:05:18 pm
I read that as phoenix.com...

then I read another part of that as my name... omfg I'm delirious from too much calc programming.
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: ben_g on August 08, 2017, 07:26:59 pm
Autodesk software can use tons of RAM. When working with Inventor (especially when rendering something) my PC often starts swapping while it has 20GB of RAM. I never used Entertainment Creation Suite Ultimate so I can't tell you exactly how much RAM it uses, but it may be useful to have more than 16GB. If you don't want to increase the RAM then make sure you get a fast hard drive (putting the page file on the SSD is apparently terrible for it) so swapping isn't that much of a pain.
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: Juju on August 08, 2017, 09:02:06 pm
Hmmm, yeah, might buy a bit more RAM, 16 GB is a minimum. So it would be better the swap file goes off the SSD? Yeah, better invest in a fast hard drive anyway. Any model to suggest?
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: kotu on August 08, 2017, 09:08:27 pm
@Juju I would have thought the best people to help you with your spec is the university itself, they should help out
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: Juju on August 09, 2017, 12:19:49 am
@Juju I would have thought the best people to help you with your spec is the university itself, they should help out
They ain't helping. They want you to buy one of their own all already made build and they provide no support if you do otherwise. Trust me, mom asked and got some stupid answer.
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: kotu on August 09, 2017, 12:40:28 am
Then use a 486
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: Juju on August 09, 2017, 12:50:11 am
Yeah right, I'm not sure that thing would run everything.
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: kotu on August 09, 2017, 12:53:24 am
Just do it
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: c4ooo on August 09, 2017, 01:52:04 am
Hmmm, yeah, might buy a bit more RAM, 16 GB is a minimum. So it would be better the swap file goes off the SSD? Yeah, better invest in a fast hard drive anyway. Any model to suggest?
What I would suggest (this is what most people do) is a ~150 (or 250) GB *M.2* ssd + 2tb HDD.
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: Juju on August 09, 2017, 02:01:53 am
Yeah, sounds good.
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: kotu on August 09, 2017, 02:05:06 am
Actually most ppl use a 1 cm memory cube which encodes data in electron spin states

(that can hold 28 billion gigabytes)
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: _iPhoenix_ on August 09, 2017, 03:16:57 pm
Some people offer no help to the topic under the disguise that they are.
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: Juju on August 09, 2017, 05:06:49 pm
If you can tell where I can buy that I'm buying it right now or else you're banned. :P
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: gameblabla on August 09, 2017, 05:32:16 pm
An SSD here would be pointless anyway because most of the time, you're going to use the hard drive anyway.
Also, if you're going to buy one 2 TB hard drive, it might be better to get two 1TB hard drives for safety. (unless you're on a tight budget)
An SSHD might be better for what you're looking for, maybe.

Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: Juju on August 09, 2017, 05:48:24 pm
A separate SSD for Windows and apps and a RAID for data might sound good, actually.

And yeah, my budget is tight.
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: c4ooo on August 10, 2017, 03:19:42 am
An SSD here would be pointless anyway because most of the time, you're going to use the hard drive anyway.
Also, if you're going to buy one 2 TB hard drive, it might be better to get two 1TB hard drives for safety. (unless you're on a tight budget)
An SSHD might be better for what you're looking for, maybe.
The point of an SSD is to get fast boot time though...
That's why I recommended a small size, personally I plan to buy like 60 or so GB ssd soon.
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: Juju on August 10, 2017, 04:42:16 am
I was looking for a video card today, looks like the recommended one is a Quadro M4000 for around C$1200, which is pretty much equivalent to a GTX 970. The only difference is whether some 3D acceleration thing is enabled in the driver (Quadro is, GeForce is not) which is required for some Autodesk programs, thing that could be soft modded, probably. Now I'm wondering if it would be more efficient to buy a GTX 1070 or 1080 instead and soft mod it into a Quadro P4000 or P5000. You guys know about those soft mods?
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: kotu on August 10, 2017, 05:00:26 am
Hey everyone!

Let's not tell @Juju about the static electricity thing! She could fry her chips!! :D


wait
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: Juju on August 10, 2017, 05:06:43 am
/me rubs head against balloon and pokes @kotu
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: gameblabla on August 10, 2017, 05:27:22 am
I was looking for a video card today, looks like the recommended one is a Quadro M4000 for around C$1200, which is pretty much equivalent to a GTX 970. The only difference is whether some 3D acceleration thing is enabled in the driver (Quadro is, GeForce is not) which is required for some Autodesk programs, thing that could be soft modded, probably. Now I'm wondering if it would be more efficient to buy a GTX 1070 or 1080 instead and soft mod it into a Quadro P4000 or P5000. You guys know about those soft mods?
It used to be possible but now you can't soft-mod it so easily. That's Nvidia (and AMD) deliberately forcing pros to pay a prenium for you.
You could do a hard-mod but good luck with that :
http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/mod-turn-geforce-cards-into-quadro-and-wise-versa.784284/ (http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/mod-turn-geforce-cards-into-quadro-and-wise-versa.784284/)
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: Juju on August 10, 2017, 05:44:37 am
Documentation is scarce, especially for newer models, but yeah, either you solder a resistor or you patch the driver somehow. And I'm not going to solder that resistor. I think I might go to play safe and get that M4000.
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: kotu on August 10, 2017, 09:19:48 am
solder the resistor on its own
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: Juju on August 24, 2017, 04:11:23 pm
Alright, ordered a brand new customized computer for C$4000 yesterday at the local computer shop (because I still have no idea how to pick parts and the guy at the shop seems way more knowledgeable than me on computer parts), I bet my mom will have the fastest computer of her class. :P

So yeah, AMD Ryzen 7 1700 (could have gotten a Threadripper but it was like $500 more expensive), Quadro P4000 (aka GeForce GTX 1070, like the M4000 but it came out this year instead of 2 years ago), 500 GB of SSD, 2 1 TB hard drives (for RAID cause why not), 16 GB RAM, gamer keyboard and mouse with RGB lights (cause she liked it for some reason?), good headphones (she'll need it), Intuos tablet, locks and some other goodies and needed stuff, I guess she'll be happy.
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: kotu on August 24, 2017, 04:22:09 pm
Steal it!!!
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: Juju on August 24, 2017, 05:15:12 pm
In 3 years when she'll be done with it, lol.
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: kotu on August 24, 2017, 05:35:43 pm
 ;D

Well I have an idea

Give her some cables
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: Juju on August 24, 2017, 05:38:43 pm
I'll install some remote desktop solution. That works.

Did I said the computer will be at the university?
Title: Re: Building a computer for art school
Post by: kotu on August 24, 2017, 05:45:50 pm
Inside an atom   ;D